Appreciating Notes

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getting closer to the real prices but 750 for a vf is still half of what many believe it should be worth

getting closer to the real prices but 750 for a vf is still half of what many believe it should be worth

A dealer had a vf in Hamilton with no price on it. I asked and he told me $ 1700

most of the ones on ebay are asking 1500 for a VF

most of the ones on ebay are asking 1500 for a VF

I haven't seen a VF on Ebay latley
PM me a link if there is

Thanks

And another thing

Why is the 1937 $ 20 Coyne Towers Prefix L/E priced so low compared with it's counterparts

Prefix L/E  -   Run 1,416,000 even less then the Ozzy
Osborne Sig - Run 1,622,000

And  the $ 10 Z/D which granted is only 500,000 is at $ 1000 UNC

Whereas the L/E is +10EF, +25AU, +55UNC from the other Coyne prefixes

The L/E is by far the lowest minted end run or changeover prefix in the entire '37 series beside that Z/D

I posted about this a while back and no one seemed to have an opinion on it.
Asking again, does anyone think these are under priced ?

I got a BC-25B Prefix H/E in Brantford today. A nice AU/UNC.
Same thing with that prefix, only around 1.4M

on The Charlton press website in the preview write up for the book the first sentence reads....

"The listings have been expanded and updated, keeping the book the most comprehensive work available in its field. All changeover prefixes for Bank of Canada notes have now been listed and individually priced, completing a process which began modestly several years ago with the 1937 issue. There is significant demand for the changeover prefixes, resulting in premium pricing."

Does this mean changeover's have moved up sharply ?
Should They ?

Hi: Just a reminder to all paper money fans, and not intending to offend, but paper money is printed, not minted... cheers...

Does this mean changeover's have moved up sharply ?
Should They ?

Buxvet

I think to advanced collectors all change-overs will be accorded premium book value (that's what the blurb from Charlton is saying) but whether that translates into reality is another story altogether.  Remember that you are not the "average collector" so if you want to sell a rarer change-over you might have to brace yourself for a luke-warm reception of your note (to the less informed).

However, I believe you are wise in snatching up any change-overs you find, esp if you can get them from coin dealers who are caught napping!  They will certainly be given their proper value eventually.  It may take a year or so for the collecting community (shorter for the dealers) to catch on to these short prefixes (particularly the 37's).  If your into this hobby for the long haul-- you can't go wrong.

Naturally a note's actual market value depends on what's "hot" at any particular time of year.  So far (and I doubt this will change) but demand seems to go in cycles (maybe this is due to the near onslaught of one auction after another!)  Its inversely proportional to what we see being sold (ie: if there's a lot being sold - demand and price sometimes goes down - few sold -demand and price goes up) like any market.  As I'm sure you know it also depends on what dealers are seeing a lot of (whether you'll get someone interested), the press a note receives, and whether dealers deem it hot (it will "move"), if you need to sell in a rush (and you wish to trade or upgrade) etc.  

These days everyone seems to be keen on O/T  1937's and DF's and certain replacements within the 1954 series (at most shows today) and certain MC's replacements, or good-overs (ie L/B EET)  If you got what dealers are looking for-- then you can move it quickly.

There seems to be less demand for regular Multi coloured notes (69/79 $5/$20), Birds (unless they're the AUJ-AUN $2 or CB $5 Blue BPN, or the EVH noBPN $20) than common 37's or 54's (unless they're genuinely UNC).  And yet Multi-coloured notes were all the "rage" a few years ago. In 2004 I got some very good deals on some UNC 37's (alas not O/T) but you could tell the dealer was happy to see them go.  Now people are even buying the C/T signature series if they're in AU to UNC at close to BV.  I've learned that it sometimes pays to "buck" the trend knowing that the cycle will return in favour of whatever issue you're concentrating on.

Bottom line is: do  what you think will work.  Your instincts so far have been "right on the money" and its unlikely they'll fail you when it comes to change-overs.  Your posts reveal that you are a "sharp" collector with insightful thought processes regarding trends and what's collectible!

I just want to add that change-overs for the 1937 issue seems like a wiser investment than they are for the Birds.  They're also a good investment for the 1954 series (particularly for Beattie/Coyne or Bouey Rasminsky signatures).

However, I haven't seen the $2 EGR or CBH command BV in the past 2 years.  I don't believe all change-overs will increase in demand simply because the book finally acknowledges us collectors' desire for them.  The market reality is that there's  a whole gaggle of paper money collectors out there who couldn't give a r@t's ass about them and will not pay premium for them.  

This, of course, may or may not present an investment opportunity for those of us who consider collecting paper mony not just a "Flash n the pan" pursuit, but I lifetime committment.  (Ha!  and I had so much to say about "hardcore collectors!" LOL )

Thanks for the changeover input walkto

I also have been a buyer of any BC-32b also a low printing short run of 2.8M B/C $ 10 Devil Prefix E/D, which unlike the '37 $ 20 carries a premium in all grades including VG I have found 3 in the last 2-3 months. All VF's In every instance they were priced just a $ 10 Dev No premium at all. Paid 35,35,25. One is a weak Vf, 1 strong VF and one dead on.

Buxvet,

My biggest problem is limited attention span!    (of course limited budget comes in there somewhere too!)

I have caught myself looking at my notes, giving them a closer inspection (have you ever noticed how critical you can be after a show?), and then putting them aside to be traded -- forgetting why I bought them in the first place!  The other problem is I'm typically a more conservative grader than most eBay sellers and even a few dealers at the bourses (why I keep my mouth shut when they grade them!) That means I usually get a bit "short-changed" on a note which is often over-graded.  I suppose I do get the odd properly well graded note at a bargain price so it all works out in the wash!  If only I could learn to keep them for a little longer and stop reaching for some other new interest!

I know I have bought a few DF change-overs yet the only one I have left is a nice EF Beattie/Coyne $2 D/B 2.8 M.  I don't have my book with me but I know I paid well over the BV simply because it was a short prefix and I thought it beats trying to pay for a asterisk (out of my league!) The others I traded (or sold) away forgetting why I collected them in the first place, often seeking a more coveted prize (ie an *NS $5.00 etc)

When I first started collecting 30 years ago: the Devil's face was like the "holy grail" for me and I bought some lousy ones just to have them in my collection.   I  suppose -- once I discovered errors/radars/ and asterisks I tired of the DF's and got rid of them.  Then I got swept up in Devil "mania" and then tired of them again (love hate relationship)!  Finally, I've come to realize there is indeed a world market (and fascination) with them-- so I stocked up on some better examples.  Seeing how the BV just keeps going up-- I wish I only got UNC now (since that's where the greatest increase is seen)!  

I would like to someday acquire a nice example of an B/C $1.00 H/A & T/A as well as the $5 C/C & eventually the E/D you mentioned.  

But that will have to wait until I get over  a major financial hurtle.  It would be nice though if I could snag a few (as you have) before they become truly popular.

 

I would like to someday acquire a nice example of an B/C $1.00 H/A & T/A as well as the $5 C/C & eventually the E/D you mentioned.  

I never noticed before, my Coyne Towers Devils Face near Solid Serial # 0400000
I asked about this in what's it worth a while back. It's only a F and mostly was told in that grade the note holds little interest. Anyways it's prefix H/A. I'mmmmmmmm RICH !! -- Changeover City Man !

Chanegeovers were few and far between at most tables. I usually keep an eye for them and will find at least one or two at a show that has no premium. Don Olmstead had lots all seperated from his usual stock. Incidenatally the ask for a Coyne Towers Devil H/A was $ 170 UNC. Considering the current book value is $ 125 for a regular which will go to proabably $ 140 in the new Charlton I can see the changeover being listed at $ 170.

This was the last show before the new book is supposed to arrive.

I never noticed before, my Coyne Towers Devils Face near Solid Serial # 0400000

I like that serial number!  The grade does impact value, but a note with that serial number should sell itself.  Changeover prefixes don't interest me, though.

I realize they don't interest you on a personal basis. But if you are a frequent seller then you need to be where the market is. I think you will see a big run on changeovers in the next year as people scramble to secure the new listings in the Charlton. Which will then drive up the prices in the 20th edition. Also the Chartered market is primed. But you have said you collect older stuff I bet you are there already

The market for change-overs is definitely over-due and a place to be right now.  Since eBay there seems to be a steady influx of regular run of the mill notes.  The odd "FIND" does occur.  Oli1001 found a misplaced SN on a $100 AJX which the seller was not aware of.. and apparently another forum member found a G/R test note off eBay.  However these examples are rare--- so I think every collector who's got some interest in a particular series would be more keen on acquiring a change-over, or at least a decent example of one.

As I wrote in the thread "Change-overs- a tricky decision" I believe the most significant factor influencing the marketability of a change-over is their "neighbour" prefixes.  If there's a large degree of replacements, short prefixes, or other desirable notes to choose from, than change-overs of that particular series might not be so keenly sought after.  

So presently, change-overs in the 37 and 1954 DF series (fewer of the modified) seem to picking up steam. They definitely are scarce.  You don't see them often now.  

Moving to today's notes:  I did not see one $10 2003 BEK nor 1 2004 $5 HOH.  2003 J/D BEK is a first and unique note since its a year change over (like he 2001 FEE), signature change-over (like FEE) and replacement (unlike FEE).  The numbers printed and released are even less than the 01 FEE.  Few HOH have been reported for 2004.  The new policy to imprint the year a note's been printed adds to the excitement of collecting these notes.

It's likely the AZN 2004 $20 will pick up too.  I doubt that the new 2007 Charlton will actually reflect the ture premium on these latest change overs.