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Topic: Royal Canadian Mint Selling 1912-1914 Gold Coins  (Read 17320 times)
polarbear
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« on: November 28, 2012, 07:22:37 pm »

  Hi Members
Just heard on the radio that the Royal Canadian Mint is selling some rare gold coins 1912-1914 $5 and $10 coins to mark the 100 anniversary.

Has anyone else heard any info on it and are they really worth it to buy?

cheers

Polarbear


« Last Edit: January 27, 2013, 12:38:38 am by coinsplus »
Philippe_B
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« Reply #1 on: November 28, 2012, 08:24:22 pm »

I just saw it on the mint's website.

I think it's DISGUSTING that the mint sells those coins because all the MS-63 and up coins from 1914 that were on the market until today just lost 50%-75% of their value.

They should have been melted, they have no respect for collectors, they just think about profit. I was planning to buy MS $10 gold coins in 2013, thank god I didn't buy them in 2012. I guess the value of the rare sovereigns will also collapse because they might offer the rare sovereigns next year who knows !

Philippe
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« Reply #2 on: November 28, 2012, 11:01:35 pm »

They are melting down 200,000 of them, so they're flooding the higher grade market and not the low grade market.

http://www.therecord.com/news/business/article/844790--royal-canadian-mint-to-sell-rare-gold-coins

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« Reply #3 on: November 29, 2012, 02:02:01 am »

Call me a fool, but I ordered a 1914 $5 as it has the lowest reported mintage.  I've never owned a $5 gold piece before and the last one I handled (1912) sold for $510.   

It's only 30,000 for all three years of production, so hopefully that won't have to big of an effect on market prices.  Sadly there is a no return policy and no mention of how they are going to be packaged.

I do Wonder why they held on to them for so long and what else is lurking in the vaults waiting to liquidated. Earlier this year the RCM was flogging average condition commemorative silver dollars for ridiculous prices as a subscription.  No collector in their right mind would pay that kind of money they were asking when you can get a much nicer condition coin from a local dealer at a fraction of the price.

This is a huge money maker for the Mint particularly with the 'premium hand selected pieces' going for 12G per set.  There is a nice markup on the individual pieces plus taxes.

http://www.mint.ca/store/product/1912.jsp?campaignName=war1912&pId=1200004&lang=en_CA

http://www.mint.ca/store/news/a-national-treasure-resurfaces-as-the-royal-canadian-mint-offers-rare-opportunity-to-own-canadas-first-gold-coins-crafted-with-pride-from-19121914-17400003?cat=News+releases&nId=700002&parentnId=600004&nodeGroup=About+the+Mint

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alvin5454
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« Reply #4 on: November 29, 2012, 07:03:19 pm »

Since I was a kid and saw some of these coins at a meetings of the long-gone Bay of Quinte Numismatic Association, I wanted a set. I think they are very attractive, especially as a set.
Never did get around to it.
I have been almost an exclusively paper collector for a long time but I bought a 1912 $5 a few years ago and still have it. It will fit nicely with the other five coins of the series I just bought from this offer.
The "premium hand-selected" examples were sold out but hopefully "hand-selected" will do, although I would rather they selected them with their eyes.
Nevertheless, the prices seem to be reasonable, even taking into consideration that the numismatic-market value will probably decline a bit with this mint offering.
The price really isn't exhorbitant consider the gold value. Many gold players predict a rise to over $2,000 in 2013. If that happens, the price of these coins will be covered in theory.
I have even gone as far as recommending as a long-term investment this offering to a couple friends with young children.
coinsplus
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« Reply #5 on: December 01, 2012, 01:34:13 pm »

Interesting article... It was always thought that the Finance Department of Canada had held on to the coins.

http://www.canadiancoin.com/coin_articles.asp?name=documents/archive/arron_aug2002.txt&title=+Restrikes+of+Canadian+%245+and+%2410+sold+out!!!

However, since a lot of coins will be destroyed and melted down, the number of coins being released especially for the 1912-1914 $5 gold pieces is still a fairly small quantity (in total about 5,300 pieces for all three years), won't hugely impact the prices, especially considering they now all sold out of them.  Interest amongst collectors from around the world to collect these coins is very strong.  Many collectors interested in the $5 gold coin and wanting one for their collection, found out to late and were disappointed to learn that they missed out on this once in a lifetime opportunity from the Mint.

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« Reply #6 on: December 04, 2012, 11:21:33 pm »

At the time I ordered I could have had 3 1914 gold $5 coins and almost ordered a 1912 $10 coin but money being tight and the future uncertain, the cost of the investment was too high.  :-\

Feeling better about the purchase as it did seem too good to be ture at first and I based my decision on the 2002 restrike set valued at about $1350 in the 2013 Charlton Guide.    Coin World states that the Canadian Government stands to reap $30,183,750.00 if all coins are sold, minus the Mint fees. ???

Worried at first that the coin would come unpackaged since no mention was made that I saw.  Kind of neat that they'll arrive encapsulated with a holographic seal.  Hopefully that applies to both types.

Only question I have is whether the coins from this hoard will be treated differently from those previously in the market place.  Should prove to be some interesting discussion material in the coming months.

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tmort
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« Reply #7 on: December 04, 2012, 11:57:50 pm »

Anyone have pictures of what the shipped coins look like?
I missed out on the $5 but this seems like an amazing opportunity.



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« Reply #8 on: December 05, 2012, 02:16:29 am »

I ordered all six different, hand-selected gold coins, and was fortunate to have ordered before all the $5 gold coins and the 1912 $10 gold coin sold-out.  I've always wanted these coins ever since I was in high school.

I would have loved to get the six coin premium set, but the price is just too hefty.  There is too much risk with site unseen and if it turns out to be a dud, no refunds. Most staff at the Mint are not educated enough at coin grading, that anything shiny looks new to them, although there could be lots of wear. Also, most staff aren't serious collectors of coins, besides picking up a modern set here and there. So the least amount of risk is the hand selected gold pieces which has a 20% premium to current gold prices. It is a small premium to pay considering the history and the beauty of these coins.

I don't think these coins will be treated any differently than the current coins in collector's hands.  Someone could just pop the coin out of the plastic capsule, and you won't be able to distinguish where the coin came from.  The Charlton catalogue will most likely make a mention of the special sale.

The hand-selected coins come in a lower cost leatherette, clamshell case.  No wooden Case.  But all coins will receive an unserialized certificate from the Mint.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2012, 01:50:01 am by coinsplus »

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tmort
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« Reply #9 on: December 05, 2012, 08:33:46 pm »

Do you think the better long term purchase is the 'Premium Hand Selected' coins or the 'Hand Selected' coins? There are only $10 coins left and I am wondering which one to purchase. Do the premium ones command a 75% premium?....the staff on the 800 number was useless when I called in with questions.
Disappointed that I missed out on the $5 coins.
Thanks for any input you experienced coin collectors can provide. I figure I havea couple days to make a decision.




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« Reply #10 on: December 06, 2012, 01:56:17 am »

Personally, I would not buy a $10 premium-selected coin at $1,750.  There is too much risk with that price, since the quality is not guaranteed.  As well, all sales are final, with no refunds and no exchanges.  For the $5 premium-selected coins at $875, given the limited amounts, I would have taken a chance on those, but for the $10 premium selected, I would go for the hand-selected and save the $750 difference plus taxes.

The following coins are being made available to the public:

Premium Hand-Selected 6-Coin Set (140 sets - $12,000 each)
Premium Hand-Selected 1912, 1913 and 1914 $5 single gold coins (291 coins - $875 each)
Premium Hand-Selected 1913 and 1914 $10 single gold coins (4,869 coins - $1,750 each)
Hand-Selected 1912, 1913 and 1914 $5 single gold coins (5,050 coins - $500 each)
Hand-Selected 1912, 1913 and 1914 $10 single gold coins (18,950 coins - $1,000 each)

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venga50
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« Reply #11 on: December 06, 2012, 02:21:38 am »

Personally, I would not buy a $10 premium-selected coin at $1,750.  There is too much risk with that price, since the quality is not guaranteed.  As well, all sales are final, with no refunds and no exchanges.  For the $5 premium-selected coins at $875, given the limited amounts, I would have taken a chance on those, but for the $10 premium selected, I would go for the hand-selected and save the $750 difference plus taxes.


I'm inclined to agree with the above in its entirety.  The RCM itself put up the following disclaimer regarding these coins:

Quote
As the Royal Canadian Mint does not grade any of its products, the use of the expression "Hand-Selected" and/or "Premium Hand-Selected" as used herein does not imply any form of coin grade, or suggestion thereof, derived from current numismatic grading standards, or other form of grading systems.

I ordered the 1914 $10 "hand-selected" coin myself, since I believe 1914 is the most valuable date for both the $5 and $10 coins.  Since it won't ship until December 28th, I probably won't actually receive it until after New Year's.

tmort
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« Reply #12 on: December 06, 2012, 08:32:31 pm »

Thanks for your insight. I primarily collect bank notes and do not know much about coins (although I have a price guide), but the uniqueness of these coins is very intriguing. The fact that they have been held at the BoC for 75 years really makes these a piece of Canadian coin history IMHO.
I am leaning towards a 1914 $10 coin.



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« Reply #13 on: December 10, 2012, 02:42:26 pm »

Only 4 selections left plus the six piece set.  1913 and 1914 $10 coins in both handpicked and premium handpicked.  No big rush to get them by the looks of it given their numbers.

Should have got the set of three $5 coins when I had the opportunity rather than debating on whether to add a 1914 $10 to my selection.

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venga50
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« Reply #14 on: December 10, 2012, 06:51:47 pm »

Should have got the set of three $5 coins when I had the opportunity rather than debating on whether to add a 1914 $10 to my selection.

Amen to that, though if I could do it over again, I would have ordered 3 of the 1914 $5 coins.

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« Reply #15 on: December 16, 2012, 01:49:32 am »



I have attached a link to the various photos of the 1912 - 1914 Canada Gold Coins from the Bank of Canada Reserve
https://flic.kr/s/aHsm33zSoK







« Last Edit: August 21, 2017, 04:04:44 pm by coinsplus »

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alvin5454
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« Reply #16 on: January 10, 2013, 02:32:53 pm »

Hello: For anyone who ordered any of these coins, as I did, the mint now reports the shipping date will be in February, citing overwhelming response.
Apparently mint staff members are now also going through all orders to confirm mailing addresses and credit-card numbers before shipping any orders.
Who knows why....
Credit cards will not be charged until the orders are shipped.

coinsplus
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« Reply #17 on: January 24, 2013, 02:08:13 am »

I received my coin on Monday.  So far, only the 1912 $5 has been sent out to buyers.  Here's my coin, the obverse and reverse.  I love the lustre and the condition of the coin.  It could possibly grade around MS-63.

I am in love with my coin. 
« Last Edit: August 21, 2017, 04:05:17 pm by coinsplus »

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Philippe_B
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« Reply #18 on: January 24, 2013, 09:52:00 am »

Very nice, did you order the hand selected at $500 or the premium hand selected at $875.00 ?

I'm still waiting for my hand selected 1914 $5.

Philippe
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« Reply #19 on: January 24, 2013, 10:59:59 am »

Hi Philippe_B,

It is the $500 hand-select version.

Not too shabby for the price. 

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Rupiah
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« Reply #20 on: January 24, 2013, 02:54:00 pm »

Nice

Wonder what paper money would say if it could talk?
tmort
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« Reply #21 on: January 25, 2013, 12:21:34 am »

Very nice. Sort I missed out, that is beautiful. :P



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« Reply #22 on: January 28, 2013, 09:25:45 pm »

Did anyone else receive their coin(s) yet. I am on the fence about ordering a $10 coin, and wanted to get other's thoughts on how nice they actually are.



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venga50
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« Reply #23 on: January 29, 2013, 12:42:06 am »

Did anyone else receive their coin(s) yet. I am on the fence about ordering a $10 coin, and wanted to get other's thoughts on how nice they actually are.

I placed an order for a 1914 $10 coin on Dec. 5, but I cancelled the order last week.  The 1913 and 1914 $10 still haven't sold out yet while the $5 coins sold out rather quickly.  True, there were about 3x more of the hand selected $10 coins than the $5, but the failure of the $10 coins to sell out by now (at prices below trends) tells me that I might have a hard time to re-sell a $10 coin for a profit in the future.

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« Reply #24 on: January 31, 2013, 01:54:35 pm »

So members

Quick question for you.  Do you think these coins were a good investment or not?  Did anyone else get the coins as I. Did not.

Just curious

Thanks

Polarbear
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« Reply #25 on: January 31, 2013, 03:00:36 pm »


Always Buying Any Replacements and Special Serial Numbered Notes In C.Unc+ Condition
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« Reply #26 on: January 31, 2013, 10:30:37 pm »


Totally agree with all your points except about gold prices on which I do not know much.

Many collectors of currency and coins often ask about returns on their collections before deciding whether to get into it. For me collecting is about fun. If I think I am going to enjoy possessing something that in itself is the intrinsic value. So for me it is like spending money on vacation or books or movies etc. It is discretionary stuff. I don't lose sleep if it goes down.

On investments in general I would be happy on average to get an annualized return of about 5% after inflation. This is for money that I would need to save for the life I want to live. I do not consider coin or currency collection as investment simply because the buy and sell spreads are ridiculously high.

I consider bullion as a way of diversification. Even then I think the equity markets as a better vehicle for that where buy/sell spreads are low and commissions are small. I would think that there is some room in a diversified investment portfolio for physical bullion.

So there you go. Bottom line - collect for fun. If you want to make money with coins and currency become a dealer. Sometimes on the way you will hit a lottery and life will seem sweet. :)


Wonder what paper money would say if it could talk?
coinsplus
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« Reply #27 on: February 07, 2013, 12:17:34 am »

Received my 1914 $10 gold coin.  Pretty pleased with it.  Fantastic obverse... some bag marks on the obverse.  Grades at least MS60+
« Last Edit: August 21, 2017, 04:05:38 pm by coinsplus »

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Shylo
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« Reply #28 on: February 07, 2013, 08:58:47 pm »

You have yourself there two really nice coins.... coinsplus.. congrats on such a fine aquisition.
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« Reply #29 on: February 07, 2013, 11:53:08 pm »

Nice coin coins plus! Was this the hand selected or premium hand selected coin?



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coinsplus
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« Reply #30 on: February 08, 2013, 11:42:43 pm »

Thank you for the compliments. 

These coins are all "hand-selected".   Received today the remainder of the coins via Canada Post ExpressPost. 

Fortunate to own the entire set of $5 and $10 gold coins.
« Last Edit: August 21, 2017, 04:06:10 pm by coinsplus »

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coinsplus
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« Reply #31 on: December 30, 2013, 11:59:52 pm »

The Globe and Mail picked up the story about these gold coins.  Interesting read, and I was interviewed and mentioned in article by the reporter.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/bank-of-canadas-gold-coins-to-be-liquidated-in-federal-push-to-balance-books/article16141316/

Michael
« Last Edit: December 31, 2013, 02:37:23 am by coinsplus »

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coinsplus
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« Reply #32 on: January 03, 2014, 10:33:47 pm »

The story got picked-up by the Wall Street Journal, Canadian edition, in the following article.  It was interesting to be interviewed in this article by WSJ reporter Nirmala Menon.

http://blogs.wsj.com/canadarealtime/2014/01/03/century-old-canadian-gold-coins-lure-collectors/
« Last Edit: January 04, 2014, 12:56:27 pm by coinsplus »

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tmort
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« Reply #33 on: January 09, 2014, 11:31:18 pm »

Any chance the Mint sells some more of these coins, even though the remaining ones are lesser quality?
I would still like to get some.
I emailed them but no reply.
They could make more $ selling them as collectible a than they would get melting them down.



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« Reply #34 on: January 10, 2014, 12:06:57 am »

Very unlikely the Mint will sell any more of these gold coins. 

The Department of Finance and the Bank of Canada have confirmed that the coins are going to the melting pot, and recycled into pure gold bullion.    So sad.

The only options to get some is a major coin dealer, eBay or Kijiji, Craiglist.

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