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Topic: Fake Birds $20 @ TDCT  (Read 5390 times)
koremore
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« on: July 05, 2005, 06:24:24 pm »

Hi all.  As an avid collector of Canadian Paper Money, I was quick to spot a fake birds $20 today.

I am a teller at TD Canada Trust, and a client today presented me with $80.00 (four twenty's).  Three were good, but one was fake.  The poor paper quality was the initial give away, and then a quick flip of the note revealed prefix QTN. Signatures were K/D.  The worst part is, I showed the Manager and after a quick trip under the UV light (the planchettes did indeed glow), she accepted the note at our branch.  My arguments were ceased, but I was a little angry.

The Optical Security Device checked out - a well-done copy.
The Planchettes glowed under UV - impressive.
The raised ink was weak, and the Fine-Line Patterns & Microprinting were there, but not sharp like a genuine note.
It was the serial # that was the giveaway.

I was proud at myself for the catch - if only I had had my Charlton handy I could have proved to my manger that no such note was ever printed!   :D

Yours,
 koremore
eyevet
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« Reply #1 on: July 05, 2005, 09:03:12 pm »

Did you get add the note to your collection?


koremore
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« Reply #2 on: July 06, 2005, 09:50:10 pm »

No, my manager made me accept the note for deposit.  To her, the note passing the UV-test was enough, although I knew better based on the serial number.

Anyway, the note by now has been shipped off Bank premises to our cash management facility.

Interesting enough, I caught a faked US $100 note today.  That's two days in a row catching funny money at the bank. Contrary to yesterday's impressive copy, this was a poorly printed note that stuck out easily.  This note will also not be accessible to me.

Keep your eyes on your notes!

koremore
emsteph
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« Reply #3 on: July 06, 2005, 10:13:09 pm »

Could you have not simply exchanged the $20 fake with a $20 from your own pocket?
koremore
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« Reply #4 on: July 06, 2005, 10:57:54 pm »

It is a huge violation of bank policy for me, as a teller, to be whipping out my wallet and trading notes behind the counter.  This looks very suspicious.  If I wanted the note badly enough, I *could* have exchanged it later in the day. However, I'd be out $20!  Mind you, I now understand from reading the various threads in this forum that there is collector demand for high-quality fakes.

Saying that, I'd like to poll my readers:  Would you have paid me "face" value for my fakie, plus covered my shipping (from Halifax, NS)?  Would any collector have offered me a small premium on top of this?  

The results of this informal poll will prove most interesting.

koremore
emsteph
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« Reply #5 on: July 07, 2005, 01:39:34 am »

I don't know if there is a real "demand" for such, but likely some would like one for a conversational piece. Most of us have likely not even seen a counterfeit note.

Asking a premium in this situation, in my opinion, would be inappropriate...plus maybe highly illegal(?). Many forum members have exchanged notes for face value while other notes have been exchanged for a slight premium. But again, I think this time would not be right to ask for more.

:)
koremore
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« Reply #6 on: July 07, 2005, 01:45:27 am »

I do agree.  Asking a premium or even selling it for face is illegal.  See this BOC site:

http://www.bankofcanada.ca/en/banknotes/legislation/repro.html

I'd like to take this moment to state publicly that I do not own any counterfeit bank notes.

Thank you for your post, and remember to check your notes!   :D

koremore
« Last Edit: July 07, 2005, 01:48:53 am by koremore »
CA_Banknotes
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« Reply #7 on: July 07, 2005, 02:16:22 am »

I'm sorry to admit, but I am purveyor of counterfeit modern banknotes from around the world.

I pay big prices for some counterfeit notes, especially some famous French counterfeits which I have bought for close to 50 euro on eBay a piece (higher than face value of a real notes in some cases).

I own a US $100 superdollar counterfeit, quality euro counterfeits, quality other European counterfeits, Counterfeits from China, Malaysia, Hong Kong.....

But I do not own any Canadian counterfeits, as I have yet to come accross one into my posession.
emsteph
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« Reply #8 on: July 07, 2005, 02:54:26 am »

Good reference from "koremore". Interesting site...never been on it before!!

One would think that the BOC is more concerned about producing notes and reproducing images than if you actually obtained a note through circulation or via a purchase for the sole intention of owning and not for further circulating.

Seems fair to me (except for us who like to share our notes via scanned images).
Hudson A B
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« Reply #9 on: July 07, 2005, 11:41:25 pm »

Hey Koremore... I am a TD Teller as well...
Found a $100 woth prefix YBJ.   NO SUCH THING.    In fact, I have basically done a little bit of basic serial numbering pattern education at the bank for the exact reason of catching counterfiets.  
You should send a PM to your branch tellers etc, just explaining what you know.
What I find is that if the paper is really good, the serial numbers are off, because they are not just some scan.  ALSO, the font is usually different on a "well done" counterfiet note.

KNowledge is our protector.

CPMS Lifetime Member #1502.
copperpete
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« Reply #10 on: July 08, 2005, 12:41:56 pm »

Koremore, you can educt your colleagues at your bank by showing them the yellow square you can see on the back of the 20$ notes of the Bird serie under a strong UV lightbulb (you can find one as a compact fluorescent spiral bulb that it could be put on a regular 120V socket of a desk lamp).  They must learn that they can't rely only on "seeing the fluorescent planchettes" (did they try to remove one?, there are embedded in the paper and could be removed with a sharp knife from an authentic note)...

To know what I mean about the yellow square, see the thread http://www.cdnpapermoney.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=journey;action=display;num=1118621644 in the case where it don't works,  it's in the thread 'Canadian Journey', 'Interesting find in BEK...'  

Hope it will help...

koremore
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« Reply #11 on: July 09, 2005, 01:19:05 pm »

copperpete & Hudson A B - thanks for the tips!

Just an FYI:  On Friday at the bank, I discovered a poorly copied $5.  I mean, it was bad.  It was Journey series, and the initial giveaway was the fact that the iridescent maple leaves stayed constant and did not shimmer.

So to recap, my week at the bank has yielded first a fake birds $20, second a fake USD $100, and finally a fake journey $5.  What a week eh?  At work, I am slowly being acknowledged as the counterfeit king...

I wish I could provide some scans for you guys, but obtaining the notes is something I'm still sketchy on.

:D

koremore
 

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