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Topic: Charlton 5th edition Predictions  (Read 10709 times)
kid_kc79
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« on: June 06, 2006, 03:23:13 pm »

Hey Folks

I saw a recent topic on the Charlton 19th edition price prediction and taught it would be a good idea to start one on the upcoming Charlton Canadian Bank Note 5th edition that is due out anytime. Just wanted to know which issuer or perhaps more specifically which series you think will display the biggest increase? Or are there any notes which will show no change or even a loss. Personally I expect all Nova Scotia notes to almost double and the 1913 series of the Royal Bank to show very strong increases. Any $50 and $100 are selling at almost 5X-10X book so hopefully these will be better represented in the new book.
Also with the CPMS working on publishing a register of notes I expect strong price increases in many cases as the public will see it’s scarcity.

Thank you all for your time

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JB-2007
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« Reply #1 on: June 06, 2006, 04:52:38 pm »

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Hey Folks

 the upcoming Charlton Canadian Bank Note 5th edition that is due out anytime.

June 16 2006
walktothewater
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« Reply #2 on: June 06, 2006, 10:19:29 pm »

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Just wanted to know which issuer or perhaps more specifically which series you think will display the biggest increase? Or are there any notes which will show no change or even a loss

I think the subject has been discussed in the thread "Appreciating notes" immediately before this one (initiated by "Buxvet").  The intro to Charlton's latest edition, which you speak of, actually more or less confirms a lot of the changes-- which correspond to some of our "beefs." Their statements refer to Bank of Canada issues and Dominion notes.  The only notes which may appear to have depreciated I believe are 1986 $2.00 which were hoarded and have flooded the market (and a few other regular issues).  No big concerns about any significant drops. This according to the small "blurb" on the new edition.

As for provincial/ Canadian bank notes, however, that topic hasn't really been explored.

OleDon
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« Reply #3 on: June 06, 2006, 10:55:44 pm »

The Charlton Press web site gives pretty indications of which banks are going to have the greatest price increases and no surprises there.

It is great that the catalogue will reflect the great increases in true market value. They have endeavoured to do this in years past too, but not as well as for both catalogues this time.

The strength of the markets are clear after several years of steep increases so the publisher & editor are now comfortable, I think, with major price increases.

Bear in mind that that Bob Graham and Bill Cross have saved the Canadian paper money hobby from the publication of almost irrelevant pricing catalogues that are often found in stamps. Neither do we see much of the deep discounts in paper that we see for coins in every issue of CCN where the TRENDS are a base for heavy discounts.

There is credibility to the Charlton catalogues for paper that is rare in numismatics and thank you Bob for that !

OleDon
rscoins
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« Reply #4 on: June 07, 2006, 05:38:55 pm »

Trends also published paper money prices, tokens and coins. The attempt is to reflect the market value of the items trended. There is and always has been heavy discounting in coins, something called a sale price. Just like Sears and other merchandise sellers. Paper is less heavily discounted as there is a smaller supply, and a much smaller customer base.

Sometimes the prices of items surprise all of us in auctions. Retail price lists are still there for shoppers, but know your dealer.

Rick
kid_kc79
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« Reply #5 on: June 13, 2006, 07:12:56 pm »

Hey folks

Just visited the Charlton web site and there are a couple previews on the 5th edition guide as well as an overview of the major performers. Interestingly most major banks such as the Royal Bank, Bank of Montreal, Bank of Toronto and Dominion Bank have all scored the top spots. Bank of Nova Scotia notes will probably rank at number one overall. I have heard of some other notes which may not have increased dramatically in this edition but would be great investment choices. These notes include all issues of the Barclays Bank, 1912 Canadian Bank of Commerce notes and Bank of British North America. I invite anyone to share their taught on which note you think may be a good performer in the near future. Thank you all for your time.

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kid_kc79
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« Reply #6 on: June 15, 2006, 07:14:55 pm »

Thank you very much for the insight Rachel. I still can't seam to figure out why the majority of the people do not collect chartered? :-/ Since I started collecting a few years ago and found out about these I have been hooked and overwhelmed by their beauty. For one I would choose a large size note over small ones any day. Their vignettes and color are usually very amazing and most are much scarcer than any BOC or Dominion. For a couple hundred buck you can own a chartered that has 10 or less recorded in the registry. I could see the price being an issue. The high graded and popular pieces usually come with a whopping $ amount. Also since there are so many banks, collectors may have trouble choosing which leads to confusion. My collection of charted is mostly investment oriented but this is because I see great potential in beautiful and scarce notes. So to sum it up, I am in it for the long run and think that chartered is the way to go. The recent uproar for these will have most likely introduce many new "big timers" which will help get this market revving. Just give it a few more years.

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walktothewater
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« Reply #7 on: June 16, 2006, 01:59:30 pm »

I am afraid "Rachel" has many good points regarding the obstacles to collecting Chartered bank notes.  Too many types is not a good thing.  Super rare isn't always good either.  Information about them is scant. I remember seeing them a long while back, and even having great offers from dealers to buy one, but turning them down.  

Many years ago, I remember telling a buddy of mine that I collected paper money and he wanted face value for his one Bank of Commerce $10 (in good shape too) but I just couldn't do it.  The reason: the whole field was just too unknown for me.  The note was gorgeous-- and likely a good  buy -- but I just didn't know anything about them.   :'(   And that was in the days when I hardly even gave a thought or care to reselling a note.  

I always hear myself talk about the "market value" until I almost get sick of it....but it always boils down to that.  Even for "character" notes that I collect for personal reasons (varied condition notes (not UNC) with odd numbers/ history/ dates stamped on them/ etc) I know I can sell with less hassle than a chartered (but the market for these are small since it's a note I find interesting for my own particular reasons).  For chartered, I need a special audience-  a specialist.

The majority of Canadians (and world note collectors) will want to collect a note which is redeemable at face even to this day (all BOC isssued notes).  Scotland, US, England, Ireland, Canada, and a handful of other countries do this. That might not make a lot of sense to us collectors who value rarity-- but it somehow adds legitimacy to a currency.  Such is not the case for chartered notes.

BOC and DOC notes have enough series, issues, and varieties to keep a collector occupied for years to come.  Some of these notes come with images of national identity, scenes, or icons that strike a cord with the collector.   Some Chartered notes have great reverse images but a lot have portraits of dead bank presidents/treasurers.
  
Collectors also like to have variations of specific denominations to collect.  They want to find special serial numbers, change-overs, short prefixes, replacements, or errors.  If 10 million notes were printed and you have a solid radar you know you have 1 of 10 special kinds of notes- an extreme rarity (out of plenty).  Can you imagine the same kind of enthusiasm for a 2 digit Chartered?   The problem is how does that make it that much more rare if there's only 100 or so notes anyway? Some of these (and provincial series) are indeed beautiful -- especially the large notes-- but as you say-- most come at a huge premium.  Their almost priced out of market!

So these are just some of the barriers that face this small specialized market.  

The only thing that I can see that might help this special market grow -- is some drastic kind of change in the BOC's monetary policy.  That would mean things like: Canadian currency turning polymer/ and a huge influx of new paper money collectors.  If that were to occur then there might be some migration into the chartered arena, lower catalogue prices, more info, and more demand.

kid_kc79
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« Reply #8 on: June 19, 2006, 07:04:17 pm »

Thank you very much your perspective

These comments do help to confirm some of the suspicions I had of why not more people are into chartered but I still stand by my predictions. With the scarcity of so many chartered notes or even issuer the market has nowhere but to move up. I have spoken to members of CPMS and they tell me that a published register of notes is in the works for the near future. This should surely help bring some light to the subject and new collectors onboard, whether it be for fun or investment.  Also if I may ask, what do you mean by going polymer? I have seen this in multiple post but do not quite know what it meant. Thanks again for your time and attention

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buxvet
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« Reply #9 on: June 19, 2006, 07:32:02 pm »

Polymer is a different material to make notes out of. Austrailia and Mexico have already gone that route

Check this out Kid

http://www.polymernotes.com/mexico.html


I have one of those 20's they are very durable. Very coutning damage resistant.
I got some from the Hotel when I was there. They look like GEM UNC 70.
But they all do. They are perfect
 

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